I'm a believer now... Is this the new H&M Wrangler sectional?

Good evening everyone!
This weekend, I persuaded my husband to take me to our largest dealer of H&M in Houston (which was a good hour drive from the north Houston area)to see the H&M line in person. I should explain to you that I've had my heart set on a fabric TK sectional for a few months and had begun the process of getting price quotes, requesting fabric samples from Duane, etc. In the MEANTIME, while samples arrived, I adopted as a hobby reading through as many posts on this forum as I can. I had not considered buying a leather sectional at all but after so much reading here, I became convinced I had to go check out the Hancock and Moore sofas and sectionals. As so many of you post day in and day out, "it's the standard", it will last you 20 years or more!", etc. , etc. ......

So I walked into "Lou---Sha--" armed with all the knowledge I've read here from Duane and others and my husband followed behind me; he was probably dizzy after having me lecture him on what this line of leather furniture is all about during the hour drive ��.... Anyway, we found the H&M area and he sits down on this huge sectional by H&M and falls in love!! Tells me this is the one we want! So I proceeded to sit in all the H&M sofas and chairs and was converted!

The sales lady came by and she knew little about it other to say we could take advantage of the 40% of sale going on for Presidents Day. Retail price $19k and on sale $11k. Well, I took pictures of it and the tag t look it up and to ask Duane for a quote on it. However the numbers on the tag are not numbers I find on the H&M site. Judging by the pictures and the measurements we took, it can only be the Wrangler. It was SUPER deep (49" overall, but most importantly 29" inside depth!!) which is what we want and I can't find any other sectional or sofa in the H&M line with that inside depth.

Below are the pictures. Can I get some help with the following questions Duane:
1) Is it the Wrangler?
2) At your earliest convenience (no hurry, with the holiday on Monday it's probably busy, etc. ), would you please PM me your price for it in a grade 3 leather (Hyde Park Tan burnished or Cameo Tan are the ones we liked)? The pieces we'd need are (according to the H&M website): 6216-2RAC and 6216-3LAF.
You quoted me a TK sectional to Texas so I have an idea of about how much I'll pay for freight. )
3) Modifications... Do you think we could have the loveseat side made 7in shorter in length? Is that too much length to shorten a piece? Would it cost a lot to do that?

Okay, that's my story and questions. I appreciate all the advice and insights. And of course, I appreciate the quote and opinions too Duane.
BE WELL,
Viviv


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Sorry the picture came out sideways. �� Tried to fix but can't ��

I will tell you why your photo is sideways..you are using an iphone for the shot, and they do this all the time. Here's a trick I learned with iphones.... after you take the photo, hit the EDIT button on the screen of your phone and then slightly crop the photo with the Cropping tool. You don't need to crop much, just a small amount. Then hit DONE. Now your photo will be in your library right side up and in any email or post you send. I don't know why that works - but it does!

As to that sectional. That is the code number for the Settlement series. And the thing is, H&M does not make a Settlement sectional - except they apparently did for Shanks. This could be a one-off experiment or something they make regularly at their request. The lines do match up to the # 4192 sofa. The second thing is there is no leather called "Apache" in the standard leather line up. That means one of two things 1) It's a custom leather they do for Shanks or 2) Shanks uses code names so it's difficult to price shop it. I will have to research this and find out what the story is on it. The Wrangler is a different model but not entirely dissimilar to it. As to mods, you can take 7" off if you like, but be aware if you do that the visual spacing will be off from left to right. For example your cushions on the non-modified side might be say ... 23" wide and if we take out 7" on the opposite side then that's 3.5" out of the cushion width and makes them 19.5" wide. Your eye WILL pick up on that. H&M will also have a surcharge for that mod.

I have PM's disabled for myself on the forum as too many members were over-using them and all questions were coming privately, which bypasses the intent of knowledge sharing on the forum. Best way to get a quote is to go into the QUOTES section of the forum and put the specs in there, then I will reply in kind and it will not be public.

Thanks!
Duane

Thanks Duane! Well how confusing! However I am thinking the modification is a no go. What other sectional (s) can you suggest to me that meet all the criteria we want:
1) seat depth of 27"-29"
2) length (wall space) 130"-150" on sofa side and on the loveseat side a max of 105" ( but can be less 80"-105")
3) good "size" not apartment sized like the city or other smaller frames
4) nothing like the Austin style, I really don't like the stacks of pillows
Any suggestions?? You've probably seen most if not all H&M frames ;)!! Several styles like the Campaign and the Arrington are appealing to me but they're not long enough on the sofa side and not deep enough on inside seat depth. We mainly want to change our current set because we want a deep seating sectional. Help!

Thanks so much!
Viviv

Hi Viviv,

The closest they will have in a standard sectional is the new Wrangler unit, model # 6216-2LAC / 6216-3 RAF. It's going to have the 29" inside depth and the wall space will be 141" x 113".

While it's too long on the one side for you @ 113" you have to be cautious about customizing that back to 105" as it may not look right. What happens is as you build these deep units, the overall depth on them goes to 49" to accommodate that 29" inside depth. If you try to shorten the run on one side and maintain that depth, it will visually go out of proportion and *can* look odd. Hancock and Moore would catch that in the custom quote and call the dealer to advise them and a smart dealer will walk you through it as I have done and explain that the 105' side will be visually lopsided. It can be done, but you may not like the end result and of course you can't squawk a custom build because of that. I have done builds like that before and seen them in person - and I do notice it. If the visual weight is not critical to you, then we can explore that option to get you want you want, but be aware custom builds like that come with no guarantees you will like it. The customers I have done that for have been OK with it, and pleased - but its just something you have to be aware of going into and a build like that also requires a 50% deposit (vs the standard 20%) and time of order and a contractual agreement that acknowledges it will be different visual scales right from left.

So, that means to get to a 105" run on the loveseat side and you will may to give up the inside depth (and this really applies to any maker, not just H&M).

Another point to note with that new Wrangler sectional is that it is a 2-piece unit, with the corner built into one side. You will have to have a 36" wide doorway to get that into, and it will be a very heavy, difficult-to-deliver piece. It really cannot go up and down stairways or make turns in the delivery very well, if at all. That's the downside of building with solid maple hardwood frames, they get very heavy in larger sizes.

If you need to say in that 105" spec my suggestion would be to look at the September unit as a 2 / 3 build (Loveseat / Sofa). That will give you 104" on the short side and around 128" on the long side of it all. You would still get 23.5" inside depth and the piece will have a nice visual weight to it and be in balance.

http://www.hancockandmoore.com/Produ...mber-Sectional

I checked with H&M and that Settlement Sectional is built proprietary - just for Shanks.

Good morning Duane!
Thanks for the explanation on how the modified cushions would look. You are right, those two cushions would look odd... Skinny and deep. I don't want to do that.

Now, I do like the September sectional. A lot actually. Do you think we could have it made 3 inches deeper in the seating area? We wouldn't mind putting down the 50% vs 20%. The only thing that could derail that plan (making the mod) would be the increased cost ( if it pushes us out of our budget).

We have a one story house with double front doors so entry into the house is easy and no stairs to worry about. However, the hallway to the living room narrows to a 37" doorway (no door though). Would the September pieces fit through? I'll post some pictures below so you can see the space and the living room. Please tell me what you think.

I'll send you a message under the quote area with the leathers we liked so that you can give me a quote.

Lastly, would you please give me your personal opinion / experience with the following leathers: Hyde Park Tan Burnished, Cameo Carmel Burnished and Equestrian Desert ? We'd like one that is not very "shiny" or slippery but more matte and soft. Also a leather that is more resistant to stretching and staining. I'm aware or a lot of the advice you've given here on the forum concerning leather cleaning and moisturizing twice a year and will definitely adhere to that. But I've read in many discussions how some leathers are preferred by you due to the way they wear and perform generally over time. I would really appreciate it if you could give me your take on these 3 leathers from your experience.

I'll send you the request for quote thru the quote area hopefully tonight.
Thanks again for all your help!!

Viviv

P.S. A tidbit about how I found out about you and your store : my husband (of 21 years) is also named Duane. So when I "ran into" posts on Gardenweb forums labeled "For Duane" it caught my attention and clicked on it to see what it was about. That is how I found out about you and the great advice you gave out to people. I kept reading until I found a post that mentioned your forum and here I am.... ;)

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Thanks for finding out about the Settlement Sectional. I'm planning on buying from you and that one is too long on the loveseat side anyhow so it's out! Thanks for finding out though! :D Shanks must sell quite a bit of H&M.

Yes, Louis Shanks is a major player in the H&M dealer lineup (but so am I). I could easily get a proprietary piece made just for The Keeping Room as well if there was something I thought was needed, but their line is so deep and board already I don't think there is anything I am missing enough to say I need it specially built on a regular basis.

One of Jimmy Moore's standards in build is that everything they make goes through a 36" doorway, and if the prototypes are too large on first build, they refine them until they do. It's a standard I really like, so yes - you are fine at 37".

The September going 3" deeper in the frame will be do-able, just put in the QUOTES segment and I will get a price for you on it. They will ask me what Grade of leather you will do the build in as that figures into the quote.

Hyde Park Tan Burnished, Cameo Carmel Burnished and Equestrian Desert. The first two are so similar as to be treated the same. All three hides are out of Italy, and the difference is Equestrian is cut thicker and is more pebbled in texture. That thicker cut means its drape on the piece is not a handsome and flowing. It's an extremely tough saddle leather and makes leather squeaking noises like a horse saddle does (all burnished hides do as well). It's handsome and solid, however it will lack the visual fun of either Hyde Park or Cameo Carme. The two burnished leathers are smoother and have more high-low to them, and make up as a warm and handsome piece. I think all are a good choice, no bad picks there.

I have no idea why my mother named me "Duane" but it does make me easier to find that more common names!