Hancock and Moore City v. Anderson and Question about Tanning Process

Hello,

I am so glad I found this forum. It has been an awesome resource for me as I learn about leather sofas, quality and construction. We are considering getting two Hancock and Moore Sofas from the town and country program and are gravitating towards the ones with the traditional arm styles. We had a chance to sit on a few today at two different stores. We like the 83 inch City and the Anderson. One sofa would be between two doorways on an 89 inch wall (inside trim to inside trim) and the other sofa would be floating in the room with its back about 5 feet from a bay window. We liked both of them and both seemed comfortable.

My husband likes the City Sofa better look-wise but my slight hesitation with it is that our current sofa has inside dimensions of 65x22 and the City's inside dimensions are only 63x20.5. My husband thinks that we would acclimate to the slightly smaller size but it does make me a little nervous since we are both often lying on on either side of our current sofa at the same time. The one other thing we noticed is that the two City sofas we sat on (at different stores) both felt very different -- one felt much more upright with less cushion space than the other (we are assuming it is because that one may have been newer) Also 2 of 3 swatches in the color we like best (Cavalier Mocha) seemed to have a very large coarse grain pattern versus the larger swatch with the same name which had a much smaller/nicer pattern and feel to it. The difference seemed very significant on that one.

I personally liked the Anderson Sofa more. I think the few additional style elements make it seem a little more special to me than the City. I also like the fact that it has a 65x21.5 inside depth which is closer to our current sofa. The cushions also felt a little more supportive to me than the City (although oddly my husband felt the oposite-- like he sank into that one more than the City). My husband isn't crazy about the high back style or the nailheads on the Anderson. I am also not crazy about the high back style but think it will be less noticeable if we get it without the nailheads. The one thing I am slightly nervous about with the Anderson is that since the back is large and rectangular if it might look too large from the back when it is floating in the room.

We also sat on the September (but my husband didn't like that the back on that one rises above the cushions and he felt that it seemed very large) and we sat on the Austin (which we found very comfortable but neither one of us likes the back cushion style). Neither store that we went to had the Journey which we had hoped to see. But, if the Journey costs much more than the Anderson it would likely be out of our budget range anyway. We also sat on the Bradington Young Daylen today. We both really liked the way it felt and the size of it but we have heard from so many people that H&M is a superior product construction-wise and has better customer service so we really like the idea of getting a H&M set.

I am curious if anyone on this forum has sat on the City or the Anderson sofas and can provide insight into comfort (especially with two people lounging on one at the same time)? I am also curious to get thoughts from others on how the Anderson might look look floating in the room so if anyone has it or a sofa with a similarly high back I would like to get your thoughts on that as well?

The only other thing we are wondering is about is the chemicals used in the tanning process. I know from calling H&M that they no longer use fire retardants in their cushions (which is great) but today we mentioned to a friend that we want to get new leather sofas and she said we should be concerned about the chemicals used in the tanning process. I am curious if anyone knows if H&M tests their hides for Chromium (VI) or other chemicals before they put the hides on sofas? I don't know anything about these chemicals except for what I learned on google today but I saw a few sites that said that Chromium (III) can be accidentally converted to Chromium IV during the tanning process and that once Chromium (IV) is present in the leather it can be dangerous. It would be good to know if H&M has a way of checking the safety of the hides since we have two small children ages 3 and 4. I'd appreciate any insight that any anyone may have about this.

Thanks in advance!

Your comments about the comfort of the two City Sofas you experienced may be due to one having Ultra Down cushions vs. Foam Core cushions. I think this is more likely than the age of the Sofas.

http://www.myfurnitureforum.com/show...highlight=core

The City Sofa comes in two sizes, the # 9840 (smaller) which is what most stores show on the floor as its in the Town and Country collection, and the larger # 9844 which is not on promo. The # 9844 measures 73" x 23" on the inside vs the smaller # 9840.

As wisejd pointed out, one of the City units you tried may have had optional and extra cost ultra down cushion cores installed, that will affect the way they sit.

Samples swatches are always made of scrap. When cutting out hides for production, appx 28 % of the hide is too coarse or too wrinkled or otherwise flawed to use in the build so it becomes salvage and that's what they make the samples from. So, when looking at swatches use them primarily for color and top coat feel, don't rely on the grain patterns to be accurate as in most cases the actual piece of furniture you purchase will have better leather on it than the swatch.

You can ask for a nail delete at no charge on any H&M piece. You can also ask for firmer cushions if you like (Q21 cores) at no charge at time of order.

If you don't care for the September or Austin, you won't like the Journey! The reason the Journey is more costly is you were looking at Town and Country program items in the September and Austin, and the Journey is not in the current 2014 promotion (nor is the # 9844 City). The T&C promo items are all scanned in here on the forum under LEATHER.

Tanning leathers is nasty business, that's why there are no USA tanneries of any size. They use hazardous and potentially carcinogenic materials in the process which can expose to the workers - but not the end consumer - and it pollutes a lot of water. Recovery and safety equipment is highly costly and 99% of all leathers used in anyone's leather products are done overseas for that reason. The finished hides have no hazardous chemicals on them. That was taken care of decades ago, can you imagine the liability exposure otherwise in our litigious culture today if otherwise? Back the 1960's there was a leather everyone used called 'China Cow', it was cheap and popular and had a little trademark brand on it. Turned out that it had active carcinogens on the surface that could be absorbed into one's skin if one sat on the piece when hot and sweaty - once that was discovered that was the end of China Cow and the leather industry made sure the finished product was safe from there on out. I can't tell you the chemical composition of the current hides, that's beyond the scope of dealer information - but I can tell you that the President of H&M visits every tannery they use as a supplier on a regular basis to make sure it meets their criteria, whatever that may be. They only use two of the tanneries in China, he has told me that, because they find only those two are acceptable. He has also told me the cleanest and most green tannery he has every seen in in Belgium, where they get the GR 5 ENVY series leather, supposedly its a phenomenal and cutting edge tannery operation.

All H&M cushion and build materials meet current California standards, which are the most stringent in the country. The Bradingon-Young pieces are labeled 'Not for sale in California' as I see them come through on the new pieces (doesn't preclude shipping them into CA, howver). There has been some debate on that however, according to all the people I speak with in the trade, all cushion manufacturers currently build to the CA standard which if true (and it comes from reliable sources) then there B-Y needs to remove its 'Not for sale in California' label.

Thanks. This is very helpful. As far as you know do people seem to be equally happy with the City and the Anderson? Are they both considered to be the same quality? Also, is there much of a price difference between the two?

Quality of the build is consistent and equal throughout the entire H&M lineup. The City is far more popular than the Anderson, however. In the T&C program, it and the Illusion are the two least expensive sofas in the entire lineup and I'm sure that is part of the reason why.