Warning About Craigslist Scams

I just successfully sold a brand new Whittemore-Sherrill top-quality leather sofa on Craigslist, but I wanted to warn everyone about ongoing scams that have plagued that website for the past several years. Craigslist is wonderful, but you do need to heed their warnings. They are based on known problems.

Here are the signs of a true scam -- and my suggested actions...
1) Place the words "Cash Only" in your Sale Ad. This usually prevents the scam I'm about to describe.

2) The first sure sign of a scam is when the potential Buyer says they will buy your leather sofa (or anything else) sight unseen. You'd have to be a fool to buy that way, yes? So don't believe a word of it -- they are playing on your sense of greed or need for a seemingly easy sale.

3) Second sign is their willingness to pay you right away through your Paypal account. The problem is NOT with using Paypal -- which is a reputable service. And your friends will ask "How can they possibly rip you off by using your Paypal account to send money?" The thing is -- they'll never actually pay you! They will only pretend they did.

4) Third sign is: They're in a real hurry because they have any of the following scenarios happening: a) They're in the military or traveling overseas and need furniture "right away!" for their return home. b) They'll arrange for a local moving company to pick up the item -- you don't have to lift a finger! c) Somebody died or is hospitalized and they need you to respond right now so they can setup house to help a sick relative or friend.

5) Their email address they are writing From: does not match their email address for Reply To:. Usually, this will be a gmail account or yahoo account. Trust me on this one -- of the 6 scam attempts I received, they ALL exhibited this. The immediate action to take? Search Google for those email addresses and the names they use! When I found almost all of mine listed on the Internet as known scammers, I was shocked. "Deborah Atteberry" is a prolific one that is used.

6) The initial email response to your ad is very short, and a little too "friendly": "Hey, mate, is that recliner still available?" No further questions about it's condition. No questions for details of any kind. I'm convinced this is generated by a scanning bot that fires off a teaser message to get you to respond.

The scenarios work out like this, usually...
First, you are asked simplistic questions. Sometimes, this is followed up by a typical storyline: "I'm traveling and out of the country. But your items look nice. I cannot possibly visit your home to review them, but I trust you. I'll send you immediate payment if you give me your Paypal account information. That way, it is safe for both of us." Oddly enough, the person sending this might use a different name than the one that first contacted you. Deborah Atteberry suddenly became Peter Simeone, in my case. The line "That way, it is safe for both of us." appeared in 4 of the 6 scam attempts I received.

They will immediately ask for your home address, and contact phone number to speed up the transaction. Time is of the essence! And you respond!

Next, you'll receive an emailed copy of an actual "notice" from Paypal stating the money has been paid. The email will say it was sent from someone at Paypal. Complete with active links, correct business addresses and logos. You gave them your Account Info, so to legitimize it, it will show that YOUR ACCOUNT has received payment. However, if you go out to your Account -- and this is IMPORTANT -- but NOT through the link in that email, you will soon discover no such transaction occurred.

After notifying "Deborah" that your info conflicts with hers, you may even receive a phone call from a Rep at Paypal telling you there's a glitch in their computer -- but confirming you did get paid. This is only if you've sent them your home address and contact info for the shipping firm.

They are not trying to hack your Paypal account. They are simply using the info you supplied to make their attempt to pay you look real.

Next, they may start bugging you about the shipping company being scheduled for pickup the very next day. You balk. They offer to send you a Cashier's Check, instead -- and, in one case I experienced, offer to include an extra $200 "for your trouble". Only thing is, that check is bogus and your Bank will not notify you until ten days after the sofa is gone. And you will be shocked to learn that a Cashier's Check is NOT guaranteed.

Please be very careful of Craigslist and insist on dealing face-to-face (preferably, not alone, however) -- and with CASH ONLY. It has become as untrustworthy as eBay in a lot of ways. These people are far smarter than we are. If you read Craigslist's own warnings you'll see they tell you NOT to do business "long distance" or sell items to someone "sight unseen". These are true signs of a scam.

This scenario also arises when you are looking to buy something -- like a car or horse trailer. As soon as they start telling you they'll ship it to you for your examination first, and asking you to put money into Paypal's "Escrow Account" -- you know it's a scam, because Paypal has no Escrow Account service of any kind.

Good Advice. I find EBAY to be more trustworthy than Craigslist overall. I use them both, but do cash-only on C/L except for minor deposits to hold an item.

The amount of scams happening on Craigslist is worrisome. There are just too many Bozos out there ruining a good idea. This past Christmas season I was shocked to hear three friends call me about the very same type of scam that happened to them in the course of two weekends. All three were saved in the nick of time because we discussed the possibilities of the offers being fake. Two involved friends wanting to buy a car -- one an old Honda just for a second vehicle; one a used Audi A8 being sold for $25,000. As soon as they told me they were being asked to pay into a Paypal escrow account, I knew something was wrong.

The third involved a supposed military veteran home on leave from Iraq. That scammer knew all the tricks. "The US Government will pay all my moving expenses." -- and they will. "Just deposit money into my Paypal escrow account and the Army will arrange to have the horse trailer delivered for free to your area so you can inspect it." Being an ex-Navy guy, the buyer almost bit. Then I found out a friend at work sold his own car to some person who bought it sight unseen -- he ended up losing the car, and $2,500 out of his own pocket. His car was delivered to some guy in an empty parking lot, and of course he never heard from him, again. So these scams work both ways -- as a buyer or seller.

The FBI actually has a website for reporting such crimes perpetrated through Paypal, Craigslist, etc. Although, they don't offer a lot of hope of you ever getting your money or belongings back.

I think this is a big of "over scare" I have used Paypal for numerous transactions, including paypal. Was scammed on one (bought airline tickets to Hawaii from a ticket broker as a wedding present and when they showed up, the broker had cancelled the tickets.) Contacted paypal and after 30 days, they refunded my money into my account.
There are scammers everywhere. What if you pay with cash and the seller doesn't ship the item.
Overall, if we are going to buy via the web from private parties, I think paypal is darn good and gives both the buyer and seller some protection

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Originally Posted by pvrick

I think this is a big of "over scare" I have used Paypal for numerous transactions, including paypal. Was scammed on one (bought airline tickets to Hawaii from a ticket broker as a wedding present and when they showed up, the broker had cancelled the tickets.) Contacted paypal and after 30 days, they refunded my money into my account.
There are scammers everywhere. What if you pay with cash and the seller doesn't ship the item.
Overall, if we are going to buy via the web from private parties, I think paypal is darn good and gives both the buyer and seller some protection

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Pvrick,

I'm afraid you have missed the point of the previous postings. Paypal might work fine the first 10 times for you, but sooner or later (usually sooner)you will run into someone on Craigslist who will try to scam you using Paypal or any of hundreds of other methods.

Several years ago I volunteered to work with a non-profit organization named "Call for Action" whose business is helping consumers solve disputes with merchants and service organizations.

In my 2 years of part-time service I saw literally hundreds of Craigslist and Ebay scams. Some of them are extremely ingenious and difficult for even an expert to spot without prior knowledge of what to look for. And they are constantly changing and becoming more sophisticated. I don't remember ever being able to recover anything for the victims of any of these scams.

Jeff Frank
Simplicity Sofas

From my forum, the craigslist post of the day.

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Originally Posted by Afiavila

Last week I purchased two early 80's motor scooters from a seller I met through craigslist. The seller didn't have the titles because they hadn't been registered in quite some time so I proceeded to purchase them through a bill of sale transaction. He did however have all of the service records for the vehicles that included the previous owner's name, address, and telephone number. I had no reason to think that anything was fishy because the man was seemingly legitimate and honest. A few days later, I tried to register them in my name at my local DMV and while I was waiting for the paperwork to be processed the CHP arrived to speak with me. They told me that both scooters were reported stolen and that I had to give up possession of them immediately. So the CHP had the scooters towed and I am out $1000. The CHP told me that I can follow up with the man to try to civilly get my money back. I called the man and he said that he didn't know they were stolen and thus doesn't owe me my money back. What can I do? I'm not even sure if the guy says who he says he is. I for certain know his cell phone number and his address. Would I have a case if I took him to small claims court? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

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Although not craigslist, this is another recent example of how online transactions can go wrong.

I bought a very rare Moto Guzzi Daytona in September of 2011 and we agreed to a price, but the seller could not produce the title to the bike. He was a bit flaky, and the bike had been abused, but there were only 50 brought into the USA and I wanted it badly enough to hound him into getting a title re-issue. He balked and at that point I began to wonder if it was stolen. Finally after a week of going back and forth with him I went to his place and had $ 3,500 cash in hand and literally 'showed him the money'. I said "DMV is right down the street, get the title and I'll wait here for you'. I had to wait an hour, but he came back with a re-issued title and we did the deal. There was no way I was buying that motorcycle without a title.

BTW, this was my winter restoration project. I took it all apart, repaired and repainted everything top to bottom, and took it out for its first ride this past Sunday. Hundreds of hours into it - most during the midnight hours when the house was asleep - and many more dollars thrown at it, too. Whoo-hoo! It works - and its fast. <g>

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/...a_edited-1.jpg

Incidentally, when I said "of the day", I meant it. The saga continues today,

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Originally Posted by matthias4

Last week I purchased a used car from a private seller on craigslist for $1800 cash. The car had issues after a 15 minute drive, it started smoking, sputtering and stalling, but I was able to get it to a repair shop and spent $600 to repair it to functioning. The ad claimed the car to have 120,000 miles which is approximately what the odometer read. But the next day, I saw an oil change sticker at the very top of the windshield which read 262,xxx miles with the date of 8-6-11. I then looked the car up on carfax and verified that the car had at least 258,xxx miles. Two days after the purchase, I had to replace the battery at $100. Furthermore, the title of the car is not in the sellers name, he told me he was selling it for a friend. But I looked up the address on the title on google maps and it doesn't seem to exist, the title looks legit though. I haven't been to the DMV yet because it seemed like the seller wanted me to go to the DMV right away. I want to be sure of what action I should take.

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Caveat emptor.

Just to follow-up, I am not saying that Craigslist or Paypal are bad tools to use on the internet. I have used both very successfully. And Paypal for many, many years.

What I wanted to point out were some of the markers of a scam. I'm surprised by the number of friends, family members and work associates who were told of this and immediately defended both entities -- and then questioned the very concept of such scams existing. It's almost as if the desire to get something cheap or to solve their immediate problem outweighed the danger signs.

To make this simpler, here are some of the signs. And if you wish to check on this, please visit Craigslist and Paypal and read their own "How to Avoid Scams" pages...
1) The buyer or seller is VERY eager. So much so, that they constantly remind you of the urgency to take immediate action.
2) The buyer or seller is "out of town" or unavailable to meet.
3) The object you are buying is too far away for you to visit to see in person -- but the Seller has a miraculous remedy for that. Such as, "I'll ship it to you to examine first. I'll pay the extra fees for this."
4) The buyer or seller insists on using a Paypal or Craigslist escrow account. This is possible at eBay -- the other two do not offer them.
5) The buyer or seller's name does not match any other contact person they mention, nor their email address.
6) On Craigslist, the Buyer's email address is a gmail account -- even Craigslist is aware of this, as well as the FBI which investigates online fraud.
7) The buyer or seller offer to have "someone from Paypal" contact you to confirm their part of the transaction -- or receipt of your escrow payment. None of these services do that. How can you possibly know they are calling from a legitimate company? If you believe Caller ID is a safe indicator, please search for "How to fake Caller IDs on a phone" on Google.
8) The buyer or seller offer to have a real receipt sent to you from either service after you report to them "Nothing is showing up in my account."

Here's the point -- and I'm sorry so many missed it...
Paypal will never truly be involved. Asking for your Paypal account does not mean you'll actually be paid. It simply "legitimizes" their effort to work with you. After they insist they paid you, any receipt you receive will be fake. And it will have all the correct addresses and working links you can imagine. I suggest you simply go to your account -- but NOT through a link in their email -- to CONFIRM you've received your money.

I'm not trying to just scare everyone. But Craigslist should mean CASH ONLY. Even Craigslist will tell you that.

Many people are under the impression that Paypal guarantees any transactions that are run through it and that they will reimburse you if the transaction does not go through for any reason. Although that may occur in certain situations it is not universal and Paypal does not protect you against deliberate scams.

Jeff