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Thread: Is a high-quality sectional doable on a modest budget?

  1. #21
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    Default Re: Is a high-quality sectional doable on a modest budget?

    The good anilines in B-Y are in GR 4/5/6, not 3. So no, nothing I like really better from B-Y. Truth be told, B-Y is not the place to shop good anilines, that's over at Hancock and Moore. Bradington Young's target market is not the fine leather buyer, It's the value buyer who wants USA-made, 8-way hand-tied and/or good motion pieces. So they really don't have a lot to offer in higher/better anilines as that pushes them out of their price point market. The category-killer in better aniline leathers is Hancock and Moore by a wide margin. B-Y is mostly a finished leather / semi-aniline house.

    The confusion here I think I see is "build quality". Bradington Young pieces have durability, what they lack is the finer points of the art of upholstery. Those are things that do not affect longevity - or usability. They are the details.

    To use an analogy, a pair of USA-made Allen Edmonds shoes are very highly crafted and the cost more than say a pair of Cole Haan's at DSW. Are you willing to pay 2x the price for the Allen Edmunds? They are certainly better crafted, and use rich leathers, but will they cover more miles on the sidewalks than the Cole Hann's? Probably not. They will both need resoling about the same time. There is art to the Allen Edmund's and superior customer service. They will even re-craft them at the factory for you as long as you own it. When the Cole Haan's wear out you toss them in the trash and get a new pair. The Allen Edmond's you re-build. And during the time you are wearing them, you enjoy the Allen Edmund's whereas the DSW shoe - is just a shoe. Now, maybe you don't want to spend $ 300 on a pair of shoes, or can't. That's understandable. To some it's worth it, others it's not and therein lies the decision you have to make as to the purchase price. And that's how I would compare H&M to B-Y. The beauty of the H&M Just in Time program, is Allen Edmonds just made some shoes (with no cuts in quality or build) at the Cole Haan price point. And that's the killer deal.
    Duane Collie
    Straight answers from thirty-six years in the business.
    My Private Messages are Disabled - Please ask questions here in the forum.

  2. #22
    reprh Guest

    Default Re: Is a high-quality sectional doable on a modest budget?

    Quote Originally Posted by drcollie View Post
    To use an analogy, a pair of USA-made Allen Edmonds shoes are very highly crafted and the cost more than say a pair of Cole Haan's at DSW. Are you willing to pay 2x the price for the Allen Edmunds? They are certainly better crafted, and use rich leathers, but will they cover more miles on the sidewalks than the Cole Hann's? Probably not. They will both need resoling about the same time. There is art to the Allen Edmund's and superior customer service. They will even re-craft them at the factory for you as long as you own it. When the Cole Haan's wear out you toss them in the trash and get a new pair. The Allen Edmond's you re-build. And during the time you are wearing them, you enjoy the Allen Edmund's whereas the DSW shoe - is just a shoe. Now, maybe you don't want to spend $ 300 on a pair of shoes, or can't. That's understandable. To some it's worth it, others it's not and therein lies the decision you have to make as to the purchase price. And that's how I would compare H&M to B-Y. The beauty of the H&M Just in Time program, is Allen Edmonds just made some shoes (with no cuts in quality or build) at the Cole Haan price point. And that's the killer deal.
    So in B-Y -- in a GR1/GR2, would you advise a finished, semi-aniline, or aniline?

    As far as H&M: I get what you're saying. Having looked at lots of pictures, they're obviously done to a really superlative standard, and I'm sure they're even more impressive in person. I mean, I'm far from an expert, but I can look at their stuff and tell that everything is in just the right place, whereas I can look at B-Y pieces and they look great, but little lines and details here and there are a little bit off.

    The shoe analogy is exactly why I find it to be a tough trade-off. I have two pairs of boots in Horween Chromexcel, which I love. I haven't had much of an excuse to buy a pair of dress shoes in the last decade or so, but Alden or Allen-Edmonds are who I would go to. I like nice leather and good craftsmanship, a lot. But so, to extend the analogy: if you could get a pair of Allen-Edmonds penny loafers for the same price as a pair of Cole-Haan oxfords, the loafers could be a _great deal_, but maybe penny loafers aren't exactly what you're looking for. (Irrelevant to the analogy, but true: I have a strong semi-irrational dislike for Cole-Haan shoes, based on them tending to be over-priced and over-styled.)

    Question about the H&M Cavalier leather: does it chip under bad stress like a finished leather, or does it act more like an aniline?

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
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    Default Re: Is a high-quality sectional doable on a modest budget?

    Quote Originally Posted by drcollie View Post
    The good anilines in B-Y are in GR 4/5/6, not 3. So no, nothing I like really better from B-Y. Truth be told, B-Y is not the place to shop good anilines, that's over at Hancock and Moore. Bradington Young's target market is not the fine leather buyer, It's the value buyer who wants USA-made, 8-way hand-tied and/or good motion pieces. So they really don't have a lot to offer in higher/better anilines as that pushes them out of their price point market. The category-killer in better aniline leathers is Hancock and Moore by a wide margin. B-Y is mostly a finished leather / semi-aniline house.

    The confusion here I think I see is "build quality". Bradington Young pieces have durability, what they lack is the finer points of the art of upholstery. Those are things that do not affect longevity - or usability. They are the details.

    To use an analogy, a pair of USA-made Allen Edmonds shoes are very highly crafted and the cost more than say a pair of Cole Haan's at DSW. Are you willing to pay 2x the price for the Allen Edmunds? They are certainly better crafted, and use rich leathers, but will they cover more miles on the sidewalks than the Cole Hann's? Probably not. They will both need resoling about the same time. There is art to the Allen Edmund's and superior customer service. They will even re-craft them at the factory for you as long as you own it. When the Cole Haan's wear out you toss them in the trash and get a new pair. The Allen Edmond's you re-build. And during the time you are wearing them, you enjoy the Allen Edmund's whereas the DSW shoe - is just a shoe. Now, maybe you don't want to spend $ 300 on a pair of shoes, or can't. That's understandable. To some it's worth it, others it's not and therein lies the decision you have to make as to the purchase price. And that's how I would compare H&M to B-Y. The beauty of the H&M Just in Time program, is Allen Edmonds just made some shoes (with no cuts in quality or build) at the Cole Haan price point. And that's the killer deal.

    I am just reading up on some things and I came across this post, I have to say I love the shoe analogy. I have both Allen Edmonds and Cole Hann (And other equivalents), but after I bought my first pair of Allen Edmunds I have only bought Allen Edmunds since. Similar to watches, once you go mechanical it is very difficult to buy another quartz.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Is a high-quality sectional doable on a modest budget?

    Here's something that illustrates the difference between Bradington-Young and Hancock and Moore. As you know, I sell both - and I like them both. However they are not the same product even though they look the same from the outside and both sit well. There is a reason the Bradington Young piece is less expensive and the devil is in the details as they say.

    Let's just look at the top frame of two chairs that are similar (as of this post, both these chairs are on my showroom display floor) The B-Y 769-25 Howe chair vs the H&M # 5637 Arrington Chair. About $ 900 difference in the chair price with similar leathers.

    The Hancock and Moore:

    Notice how the top of the back rail is padded all across the wood frame - very smooth and you won't "feel" the wood as you put your hand around it. The corners are stitched. The nail trim is put on as close to perfect as you can get. The "picture frame" area between the two rows of nails is 3D and obviously padded to show a shape. Solid Maple Frame.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The Bradington Young:

    See the lack of any padding on the back top rail? It's just leather over the wood and uneven from the corners across the top. The Corners are folded leather, not stitched. The nail trim looks like I put it on myself. The "picture frame" area between the nail trim borders is flat and lifeless. Plywood Frame.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    When you develop a sharp eye, it becomes clear how the lines differ. It's YOUR money, you decide what works best for you. Both chairs will have great longevity and comfort, are the details and craftsmanship worth the extra? Only you can decide - I'll gladly sell you either one.

    I will say that generally my Hancock & Moore customers are not real happy if they are used to H&M build quality and try a piece of B-Y to save money, they notice the details very quickly.

    Always buy in your financial comfort zone as well, those that stretch to get something they really cannot afford are rarely happy with their purchase.
    Last edited by drcollie; 01-30-2019 at 10:54 AM.
    Duane Collie
    Straight answers from thirty-six years in the business.
    My Private Messages are Disabled - Please ask questions here in the forum.

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