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Thread: Hancock and Moore Price Increase

  1. #11
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    Jul 2008
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    Default Re: Hancock and Moore Price Increase

    Here's the list of grade changes on Hancock and Moore, and these include most all of the very popular burnished leathers. A lot of customers who were "thinking" of ordering Hancock and Moore are going to be in for a pretty big shock on the current pricing that is now in effect. I fear it will take H&M out of the reach for many in the leathers they wanted to buy, we will find out in months to come.

    All is not totally lost to still get a deal however. The Town and Country Program (its listed here in this section of the forum) is still in effect FOR NOW. Also, the Your Way Program in promotional leathers. These were all going to change on 02/15/21 (and everything in a burnished leather removed from the program) but it all was temporarily shelved as there was a bit of an uproar over all that was being taken out. So its getting revised and we will probably have another 4 to 5 weeks of using these as they now exist. Now you have a "heads up" on where the best deals are by far - Town and Country Program or Your Way Promotional. Especially anything in a burnished leather. I know I intend to order as many pieces as I can comfortably put into my warehouse because I don't think prices will ever again be this good. And if I'm ordering, you should be too.

    I suspect the T&C Program will be cut back in the number of frames, the burnished leather items may be gone entirely, and you will see perhaps a 20% increase in price when the revisions come out.

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    Duane Collie
    Straight answers from thirty years in the business.
    My Private Messages are Disabled - Please ask questions here in the forum
    I ask that you do NOT call my store with general furniture questions, that is what the forum is for

  2. #12
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    Jan 2018
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    Default Re: Hancock and Moore Price Increase

    Hard to wrap my mind around, but cayman coffee whent from a grade 5 to a grade 9, which sounds terrible price wise, but I don't really even know what that means. Will an ottoman in that now cost as much as a sofa or are there going to be smaller increases from one grade to another now that there are more grades? I guess we will have to wait and see exactly what the impact is. I see the Capri leathers didn't move and they might actually be the better value for the quality of leather you are getting. I am still hoping to find a way to get a recliner in that some time.

  3. #13
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    Default Re: Hancock and Moore Price Increase

    Grades are pricing steps. There used to be five price steps, now there are nine. While I have not done the match on the new grades, on the old system of five grades it was roughly 12 to 15% increase per step. I suspect these will be likewise.
    Duane Collie
    Straight answers from thirty years in the business.
    My Private Messages are Disabled - Please ask questions here in the forum
    I ask that you do NOT call my store with general furniture questions, that is what the forum is for

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
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    Default Re: Hancock and Moore Price Increase

    As I suspected, Hyde Park moved up. Just my own opinion, but I've never understood why that line wasn't already ranked a higher grade.

    Yes, my husband and I adore the Capri hide on our sofa. It has an amazingly soft, glove leather hand. It is beautiful. However, my personal favorite is the Hyde Park hide we have on our two wingbacks. I love it because I like the silky hand and it has a terrific depth of color and I truly love the way it wears, showing marks, scuffs, etc. which easily rub out, if one chooses. Capri is superior and provides a fantastic hand and very refined look that pretty much stays the same as the day it arrived. Hyde Park is beautiful, feels terrific, and is wearing/aging just the way I love...like a gorgeous, vintage, English library chair.

    Sorry to have gone sort of off topic. Yes, the price increases look to be stiff. Hoping I will be able to get the last few pieces on our to-buy list.

    Duane, would you speak a bit more to the earlier statement regarding Century seemingly preferring to work with designers instead of mom-and-pop showrooms? Designers certainly have an important place and definitely can save one from making costly mistakes, but many customers prefer going solo. I trust your experience and vast knowledge. Your guidance was on-point when we were purchasing our sofa and wingbacks. I hate the idea that Century might come between me and the person I choose to work with. Is that what you see coming?

  5. #15
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    Default Re: Hancock and Moore Price Increase

    I don't have any firm information, just speculation. Century has always been geared towards the designer market and the higher end servicing the upper income earners. They don't run "sales" and promotions. Rather they offer hundreds of customization options and cater to designers/clientele looking for unique, high quality items. Think Architectural Digest I carry very little in my store, not because I don't like what they build (I do), but my client base as whole won't pay their prices. A USA-made dining table and set of (8) chairs can easily be $ 15,000 for example. If I were to put that in my store, the table and chairs will get shopworn before they sell, resulting in a loss due to markdowns to move it.

    Here's an Example of a piece I have in my store that so far, no one has seriously even looked at. This is a Century AE9-212 Endicott Chest by renowned designer Thomas O'Brien. I was able to buy this as a Market Sample at a very good price. Through a Designer, this piece would sell for appx $ 8,800 to a client. My store price if I were to order it straightway is $ 5,625. However, because I got a Market Showroom special on this one only $ 3,249. And the only two comments it has generated from anyone is "boy, that's expensive", and "will you call me when it's $ 2,000?". So if I can't move this unit at $ 3,249, why would I want to order stock at $ 5,625? And yet, a Designer who has a $ 100,000 budget for a client can bring this in to the project at $ 8.800 for a client. So that's where the market is for this category of goods.

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    My Brother in Law is in this category. He's wealthy, and he and his wife don't want to be bothered with picking things out, even though they both know I can help him save quite a bit of money being in the business. They prefer to hire a Decorator, pay them $ 100,000 and when they walk into one of the three homes they own it's all done. When you make $ 3 million +a year in income, you don't really care if the chest is $ 8,800 or $ 3,249. That's the Century client and customer - through a designer who installs turnkey, right down to the lamps, picture frames and mattresses on the beds.

    Hancock and Moore has always had lower profit margins than other manufacturers. I know that's hard for some people to comprehend, but it's true. Now that Century owns them, I am not surprised they are bringing up pricing closer to industry margins as a whole. I think the 5% Off Sale Periods are gone forever, but there will still be Town and Country promotions. For 2021, I know they are concentrating on efficiencies and want to get back to 6 week production times. So you will see less new product introduced and them working hard to improve on getting pieces out the door.
    Last edited by drcollie; 1 Week Ago at 01:42 PM.
    Duane Collie
    Straight answers from thirty years in the business.
    My Private Messages are Disabled - Please ask questions here in the forum
    I ask that you do NOT call my store with general furniture questions, that is what the forum is for

  6. #16
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    Default Re: Hancock and Moore Price Increase

    Thanks for the information, Duane. I get it.

    My sister is the same as your brother-in-law, although not with regards to the budget size. She absolutely will not spend time making design decisions, selections, etc. She does have a site meeting with her designer in order to nail down "the look" and then hands over a housekey. That certainly is one way to go and more power to her! I'm not that person. I enjoy working out my design, doing the research, treasure hunting, and so on. To each his own.

    It seems Century has made the business decision that those in the market for H&M are (should be?) less sensitive about price than what they see as the average consumer. That's perfectly legitimate as they know what profit margin they want. That's business.

    We'll remain hopeful that we will be able to get our pieces, but I'm telling you here and now that we'll do that only through you. You are the king with your experience and freakishly detailed knowledge. That level of assistance simply is not available in our location. It's a pita dealing with shipping, but having you in the equation makes all the difference.

    You are much appreciated!

    TXCajun

  7. #17
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    Default Re: Hancock and Moore Price Increase

    "You are the king with your experience and freakishly detailed knowledge"

    OK, You made me laugh at my desk reading that! Guilty as charged. I think it stems from my desire to really be able to answer client's questions well and truthfully to the best of my ability, because I know as a consumer myself there is nothing more frustrating that know-nothing salespeople or false information, or failure to follow through from a business. So I really dive in on things to get the answers, and that means trips to the factories and talking to the workers, because although I love the gals in Customer Service and the Management Team, they can't tell me WHY an arm is attached to a 6738 Sebring chair the way it is, but the man putting the frame together will spend 10 minutes explaining the joinery to me - just happy someone actually cares about his work. That's the fun of the business to me and getting to know the faces at the end of the phone calls at Hancock and Moore. Good people there, they work hard and care.

    There's a post here today on a Capri leather issue and it's actually killing me to keep quiet about it. I know exactly what the issue is but can't interfere because that client is not my customer and I can't be put into a position where the consumer is going back to their selling dealer saying "This dealer in Virginia said.." Then that dealer - mad-as hell - will call the factory and file a complaint about me interfering in their business and they would be right to do so. Suffice to say, if that was my customer it would be handled quickly, easily and with no drama. And that's because I know what is happening with that leather in that particular situation. There is a difference in how dealers handles issues and as much as I would love to help, I can't in that circumstance.

    I am 66 years old now. I can't load sofas like I used to, my body can't take it. I used to be able to unpack ten sofas a day, bring five in the store and load five for delivery in the truck all by myself and be ready to go the rest of the day. Now, three sofas and two recliners will wipe me out and I can barely get out of my office chair afterwards. And forget about dual recliner sofas, too heavy for me anymore. I am think of retiring in the next few years, but my adult kids don't want the business and Hancock and Moore's VP said to me in a conversation we had yesterday that I can't retire! "You have too loyal a following and know too much about the Hancock and Brand to sail off into the sunset" However, they said I can have a dealership no matter where I retire to (it's too cold in Wash DC) so we will see. I'm not much on sitting around gazing at sunsets and I don't play golf. Not going to Texas though, its REALLY cold there. lol. Surprised you have power to reply on your computer reading about it all in the news and all the electrical failures for millions in your state.
    Duane Collie
    Straight answers from thirty years in the business.
    My Private Messages are Disabled - Please ask questions here in the forum
    I ask that you do NOT call my store with general furniture questions, that is what the forum is for

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
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    Default Re: Hancock and Moore Price Increase

    Duane,

    Please don't retire! Ok, as much as we do need your expertise, you retire when you want. You've earned that!

    Texans certainly have had a rough go with this winter storm and the power grid issues. Other than north Texas, we really aren't used to extended periods of ice and snow. And, by extended I mean more than a couple of days. Heading toward a week and that's significant for us. Yep, we do see some winters with a bit of snow, sleet, and sometimes have issues with getting around on icy roads. This kind of winter storm event isn't "unprecedented", but it is rare for us. We are used to dealing with 115 degree summer days, but not this.

    My area just came back online with uninterrupted power for almost 24 hours, now! Other areas remain with either periods of scheduled blackouts or absolutely no power since this started. Some have no water because of either the rolling blackouts messing up the water plant mechanics or the freezing water lines/plumbing.

    My sister lives in Louisiana and they (her area) are having the same problems with power and water. Her power has been restored after three days of no power and then rolling blackouts, but they have been told not to expect restoration of water until this coming Saturday. For some reason, these things happening in Louisiana aren't making the news like Texas. Maybe it has to do with the population size? Maybe it has to do with ugly politics?

    This has been very bad for many, many Texans and absolutely tragic for others. Everybody is doing the best they can to help themselves and others. We'll figure out how to manage better for a next time, no doubt.

    TXCajun

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
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    Default Re: Hancock and Moore Price Increase

    OK, well your mention of retirement might get me to find the money for my recliner this year for sure, lol. I hope if you decide to fully retire at some point you keep an online presence to share your extensive knowlege.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
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    66

    Default Re: Hancock and Moore Price Increase

    Funny, I placed the order last Saturday (my wife wanted another Author Chair in Buckingham Walnut Burnished with Cameo Mocha gimp/welt) and they charged me $3,300 (it was $3,020 without Covid price hike from local dealers, they were using 45-46% off MSRP before Covid and 52% now).
    As Century (evil overlords!) is bringing move value to the shareholders and burnishing is a manual/time consuming process they moved burnished hides to Class IV, so here is your 16.5% hike. But there is still a value in Italian "pull-ups" Tiburon/Tuscany as they stayed in Class III and there is only 2.5-3% price increase.
    I ordered all time favorite "072 Campaign Cocktail Ottoman" in 2 tone as well, Tuscany harness for the top and Cameo Brown Burnished for the bottom, so MSRP moved from $3,495 for Class III to $3,585, 2.6% increase and to $4,005 for Class IV (burnished), 14.6% price hike.

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